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thehookup@ourchart.comFemme, Andro, Butch... So many labels
July 6, 2008 - 5:56pm — naughtymistressI dont understand the issue of labeling lesbians into these ridiculous stereotypes. A femme always has to be the submissive, or the one who looks so pretty all the time with those sultry tight dresses that just make u look around and watch her sway. The butch always so much like a stud, the type of woman that can wear baggy clothing and low jeans with boxers; always the dominant and never the submissive. I dont understand what the hassel is all about, we are all lesbians, to the core we are all in love with women, why do we keep putting more labels to ourselves when the society we live in already classifies us into outcasts and has given us our own labels prone to there own ideals of what we are and not who we are.
My question is, Is there anyone else out there that believes like I do that labels are meant to be broken and not attended to?
And, do we trully fall in love with the women or the label?
I leave this amongst you all to blog and comment.
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27 Posts
hmmm
Yeah, I don't like being labeled at all.
I change what I like depending on my mood that day. One day I might feel "girly", the next day...not so much...I just do whatever and like whatever I want depending on how I am that day lol. I really don't have any one set "label" I'd fit because they all fit at different times, I guess?? Just depends. ;p
Labels are so limiting
Labels are our pathetic futile attempt to put everything into a little box, into the binary either/or. Of course we couldn't go about our everyday lives without them. They have their purpose to an extent.
That being said, I dislike labels too. Just because I don't usually dress girly I'm "labeled" a soft butch or boi. The problem is that people expect me to behave a certain way and I feel pressured to act accordingly. Like heaven forbid if I wear a skirt, make-up, or don a pair of high heels. I get the third degree from some folks I know when I "step outside" the label they've given to me.
I think we're so socially conditioned to respond and act based on labels that we just carried them over to the gay world. You know like when your ignorant relative says, "So which of you is the woman and which is the man?"
Any ways labels are so limiting.
Labels are bullshit.. Not
Labels are bullshit.. Not just in the lesbian worlds too but in the real world with everything! Gay, straight, lesbian, bisexual etc.. Who cares? Who cares who you want to sleep with, who your attracted to, who you fall in love with or what sex you want to be.. Your just you.. When I watch People on the street I don't say 'oh he's gay, she's butch so obviously a les' you know?
But unfortunately that's how this world is and everyone in this world will categorise everyone. Plastic, power suit, hippie, homeless, suger daddy, soccer mum.. That's our world :)
eh...
i dont like labels...the only thing i care about is the woman...and i'm not to fond of the submissive/dominant thing
its pretty much annoying to me
up until recently I have
up until recently I have been against labels
now I am realising, that label should only be used by the person herself to use as a tool of comfort
some individuals NEED the feeling of belonging
and should not be judged for wanting a label
if you are confused about yourself or need to figure yourself out, label comes in handy
at least to start with
to label someone else is an entirely different subject though
x
m.d.
I hate labels!! I sort of
I hate labels!!
I sort of feel like "butch" and "femme" would identify me as a "boy" or a "girl" respectively, in a lesbian relationship. Which is stupid, because well, in a lesbian relationship there is no "boy" (well, except if my girlfriend decided to transition to male, but that is a different story). Sure it's OK to say you 're butch or femme or anything in-between if by that you are trying to describe the way you dress, or even the way you are dressed *today*, but anything beyond this just seems pointless. Lesbian (or bisexual in my case) is enough.
he he
labels are for labelmakers!!!
viva la boobs!!! :)
personally, i'm not a fan of
personally, i'm not a fan of really butch chicks. androgynous, yes, dikey, yes, but butch to the point where i think you're a bloke, no. that's just me. :-)
I'm cataloguing me
Into femme and butch so it can be decided once and for all. I just posted a blog on it.
It seems important... or...
I had nothing else to do.
But I still haven't figured it out.
Well
All I care is she is a woman.
Like..
Whatever. Who cares?
labels are for clothes
I always thought that femme, butch, andro, etc are all just clothing styles. To base someone's personality completely by the clothes they wear is ridiculous. Just because I wear sweat pants does not make me an athlete, and wearing a designer evening gown does not make me a celebrity.
I personally like going back and forth with different clothes, it keeps ignorant and simple people guessing as to what I am and its kinda fun too, I mean I can dress like a punk one day, a hippy the next and a femme another.
*insert something witty here*
I'm with you, Dani. I'm the
I'm with you, Dani. I'm the same way.
I DONT LIK ALL THAT MY SELF
I DONT LIK ALL THAT MY SELF I THINK IM JUST BEING ME...LESBIEN IS WHAT I AM AND WILL ALWAYS BE...I IM NOT A FEMME AND DO NOT LABEL MY SELF AS AN BUTCH, DIKE, OR WHATEVER....JUST LABEL MY SELF AS BEING ME( APRIL)
UR GURL APL!
I dont understand what the
I dont understand what the hassel is all about, we are all lesbians, to the core we are all in love with women, why do we keep putting more labels to ourselves when the society we live in already classifies us into outcasts and has given us our own labels prone to there own ideals of what we are and not who we are.
Why narrate what is inherently a sexual tendency (which is extremely plastic) as an identity construct? It makes for really bad narrative, in that it narrates very little, objectifies the experience, and boxes the breadth depth and complexity that your sexuality is into some shitty little playing-into-the-gender-binary category and turns sexual selfhood into a label performance. Fuck 'lesbian' -it's beside the point. A lot of the queer discussion I hear is people convincing themselves of their identities, building up walls and drawing lines in the sand proclaiming who they really are, as opposed to just letting themselves be... and daring to contradict what they purportedly know about themselves. Lots of lesbians meet nice boys. Lots of nice boys meet other nice boys. A friend's once lesbian partner is FTM. What are we squaking about?
We are all lesbians? To the core we are all in love with women? What does this mean? I don't know what my core looks like and I don't know who my future partner is or what the intention of my future desire might be. I am in love with my conceptualization of "woman gender", what I project on to somebody who I recognize as female, or that I am in love with female bodies? What is a female body?
If somebody is into performing a "stereotypical dyke identity", enjoy. These labels have more to do with gender expression than anything else, and they are in turn establishing their own gender norms and identity politics. Just like lesbian does. Just like woman does.
People use labels in order to show that their identity is complex, or to hide behind them, to foster a sense of security or solidarity with a group. They use it to other themselves, and to discriminate against others. Lots of reasons. I don't like any of them. I don't think we should have to use labels or construct identities in order to achieve any of these things.
agree
labels are so hetero to me i always though being a lesbian was enough to be labeled as. i can not even label myself, can not stand when someone labels me all i can say is no i am just me. i dress how i feel and react how i feel. we are all females we all have aggressive and submissive sides to use so i do not see the big deal. some ppl like certain female's i understand that, but so many ppl are misjudged because of labels i am all the time. like the saying goes "don't judge me you don't even know me.
I fully agree
I hate labels myself because I wouldn't even know what to label myself. I like to dress in nice clothes, wear make-up and then there are the days that I want to totally relax and wear baggy pants and t-shirts. I just hate how we have to conform to a certain look to appease others. I am fine with the lesbian label, but beyond that point it just ridiculous.
I don't like those labels
I don't like those labels either, even more because I was never able to fit into one, even when I felt forced to.
I mean, labels are there for stupid people to handle the world easily, I don't need them.
Anyways, I hate being labeled, and then forced to live by it.
Sometimes I'm more feminine, sometimes not, sometimes I like being submissive, most of the times not... It's all so fluid with me, depending on circumstances, who I'm with, day of the month and so on. I just hate those expectations that come along with any kind of label. I'm myself, one and unique, if you can't handle it - buzz off.
it's true. labels do suck
it's true. labels do suck because you assume/expect smth abt their personality right away when u see that person. but that's what we made ourselves. not anyone else. we made up all these labels and now we're stuck and keep arguing over their truth. some of it might be true, some not.
who cares? live your life and dress like you want. someone calls me femme? so be it...the next day i might be a tomboy. style changes quickly.personality doesn't.
"Killing for Peace is like Fucking for Virginity."
All kinds of labels are
All kinds of labels are silly. In lesbian world, in any world. Quit it
labels make me gag. because
labels make me gag. because ppl are so much more complex than words.
but i agree that they are meant to be descriptive rather than to create stereotypes (i guess calling someone butch is just like calling someone a brunette or preppy)
.
This same topic has been hit over and over again.
Fact #1. We're all gay. That's that.
Fact #2. We refer to those ""labels"" for faster visual imagery, any clever lesbian shows little care for dramatic tagging.
you're the only one who came remotely close...
to a logically sound response to this post. props for the inclusion of neurobiology [although you applied it with more of an anthrolinguistic emphasis - labels = nomenclature for "faster visual imagery] and one of it's many evolution-tailored safeguards [this for those not following, would be the perception and rapid assessment of the external world via the activation of memories created from a previous similar synaptic occurence; ie what action/inaction was taken previously, what consequences ensued and finally were these consequence acceptable - naturally all this must be carried out by the brain in less than a few seconds as these functions were primarily concerned with the avoidance of mortal danger]. These neurological calculations performed at lightning speeds happen involuntarily and in situations not necessarily involving life threatening circumstances but such patterns of throught have nonetheless made each and every lingua franca since the dawn of speech significantly indebted to "labels".
This.
I'm not particularly "fond" of labels. But that's just it. For a quick image. You're you. If labels bother you so much then ignore it.
I agree.
I agree. I like labels just for mental organizational purposes. Weird, I know. But I don't judge people by them or live according to a label myself.
I never heard of femme =
I never heard of femme = submissive and butch = dominant until I got on this site...isn't there that saying 'butch on the streets and femme in the sheets' or something like that. I think those types of labels are silly. even 'femme' 'butch' etc are dangerous because someone can consider herself really femme but be seen by everyone else as totally butch, so labels don't really work.
I agree
Lesbian is enough of a label for me thank you very much. I love women and that's really all you need to know. I think you fall in love with the woman and while everyone has "types" they might not all fit under the same label.